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Author Topic: Congratulations to the Labour Party  (Read 1176 times)
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Bernie
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« on: February 15, 2023, 09:58:34 AM »

After 2 years the European commission on Human rights has taken them out of special measures relating to their anti Semitism.

Must be nice for their members to know they are no longer in an officially racist party.

The question now is will Starmer re-admit  :steptoe: to the party or will he insist his local party select a new candidate?
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Bill Buxton
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« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2023, 10:47:53 AM »

For several years Smarmer was Corbynís deputy and actively supported him. Not a mention of Labourís anti semitism then.
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Bernie
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« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2023, 11:37:05 AM »

For several years Smarmer was Corbynís deputy and actively supported him. Not a mention of Labourís anti semitism then.

Margaret Hodge was asked that on BBCR4 this morning - why would Starmer expel him when 2 years ago he wanted us to vote him in as PM, but she obfuscated.
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Bernie
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« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2023, 11:42:31 AM »

UPDATE

Jezza finished

 :steptoe:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11753187/Keir-Starmer-says-Jeremy-Corbyn-NOT-allowed-Labour-candidate-election.html

Expect Lammy, Abbott, Owen Jones, Ash Sarkar etc to fill their pants in anger  :nige: :steptoe:
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myboro
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« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2023, 06:21:49 PM »

The report also confirms that claims of antisemitism against Corbyn were weaponised by his internal enemies in order to create an air of moral panic around the prospect of his leadership; a fact that few will find surprising considering that the right immediately stopped pretending to care about Jewish people five minutes after Corbyn was out the door.
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myboro
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« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2023, 06:28:31 PM »

The Labour Files, based on what producers say is ďthe biggest leak of confidential documents in British political history,Ē detailed harrowing bullying of party members by Labourís bureaucracy and the rigging of democratic processes. Most chillingly, the series exposed a current of anti-Black racism and Islamophobia in the party under Starmer, at times apparently encouraged by its most senior officials.
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Bob End and his Sexy Bitch
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« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2023, 06:37:23 PM »

Worraloadashite. Starmer  :wanker: :wanker:
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kippers
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« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2023, 08:09:57 PM »

Simple fact is that they are now more chance of gaining a win than any time under Corbyn.

  His links with Hamas, Hezbollah  and the IRA was too much for a normal voter to stomach.
 And then of course his love for Diane Abbott  klins
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Bob End and his Sexy Bitch
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« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2023, 11:38:21 PM »

Simple fact is that they are now more chance of gaining a win than any time under Corbyn.

  His links with Hamas, Hezbollah  and the IRA was too much for a normal voter to stomach.
 And then of course his love for Diane Abbott  klins

Agreed, with sadness.
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myboro
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« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2023, 02:40:06 AM »

Simple fact is that they are now more chance of gaining a win than any time under Corbyn.

  His links with Hamas, Hezbollah  and the IRA was too much for a normal voter to stomach.
 And then of course his love for Diane Abbott  klins

Agreed, with sadness.
Votes Cast
2010 Con 10.7M, Lab 08.6M
2015 Con 11.3M, Lab 09.3M
2017 Con 13.6M, Lab 12.9M
2019 Con 13.9M, Lab 10.3M

Now it is reported as worst result ever in 2019 but more votes than Blair, Brown or Miliband on both occasions. Interesting the apparent surge from Red to Blue in 2019 was a lie.

Labour lost leave seats as Starmer and Mandelson made a 2nd referendum policy. Boris got similar to May in actual fact but as Farage said our system does not lead to the right result.

Nigel Farage said first-past-the-post is 'now totally bankrupt' after his party came third in the total number of votes cast, but got a fraction of the 56 seats of the SNP or even the eight MPs secured by the Lib Dems.
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kippers
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« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2023, 08:36:32 AM »

Simple fact is that they are now more chance of gaining a win than any time under Corbyn.

  His links with Hamas, Hezbollah  and the IRA was too much for a normal voter to stomach.
 And then of course his love for Diane Abbott  klins

Agreed, with sadness.
Votes Cast
2010 Con 10.7M, Lab 08.6M
2015 Con 11.3M, Lab 09.3M
2017 Con 13.6M, Lab 12.9M
2019 Con 13.9M, Lab 10.3M

Now it is reported as worst result ever in 2019 but more votes than Blair, Brown or Miliband on both occasions. Interesting the apparent surge from Red to Blue in 2019 was a lie.

Labour lost leave seats as Starmer and Mandelson made a 2nd referendum policy. Boris got similar to May in actual fact but as Farage said our system does not lead to the right result.

Nigel Farage said first-past-the-post is 'now totally bankrupt' after his party came third in the total number of votes cast, but got a fraction of the 56 seats of the SNP or even the eight MPs secured by the Lib Dems.


And ?
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myboro
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« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2023, 02:19:57 AM »

Simple fact is that they are now more chance of gaining a win than any time under Corbyn.

  His links with Hamas, Hezbollah  and the IRA was too much for a normal voter to stomach.
 And then of course his love for Diane Abbott  klins

Agreed, with sadness.
Votes Cast
2010 Con 10.7M, Lab 08.6M
2015 Con 11.3M, Lab 09.3M
2017 Con 13.6M, Lab 12.9M
2019 Con 13.9M, Lab 10.3M

Now it is reported as worst result ever in 2019 but more votes than Blair, Brown or Miliband on both occasions. Interesting the apparent surge from Red to Blue in 2019 was a lie.

Labour lost leave seats as Starmer and Mandelson made a 2nd referendum policy. Boris got similar to May in actual fact but as Farage said our system does not lead to the right result.

Nigel Farage said first-past-the-post is 'now totally bankrupt' after his party came third in the total number of votes cast, but got a fraction of the 56 seats of the SNP or even the eight MPs secured by the Lib Dems.


And ?
FPTP is not actually Democratic according to Farage.

Another example is 2005 when Tony Blair/Labour won 355 seats from 9.5M votes.

Note that is less votes than Corbyn in 2017 AND 2019 but a stonking majority from 36% of votes.
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kippers
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« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2023, 07:59:26 PM »

ah well.

You have to win more votes in the right areas.
It might not be great, but if it kept Jezza out of the hot seat thats fine with me.
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myboro
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« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2023, 03:28:13 AM »

ah well.

You have to win more votes in the right areas.
It might not be great, but if it kept Jezza out of the hot seat thats fine with me.
Is that an I am alright Jack so I do not care or have Empathy for those who are not.

JC first policy was to end Homlesness, are you against that Kippers?
Do you think Nationalising Energy like Macron did to keep bills down for all is wrong?
Tell me how a man who was Chancellor and hid £27 Million in an offshore Trust in his parents name to avoid tax is not IN JAIL?

You keep worrying about Asylum Seekers over the real Parasites in this country LOL
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Rutters
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« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2023, 11:28:32 AM »

You raise some good points but the problem remains that we can't see any examples of Socialism actually working.

You could point to The Nordic Model but that's Social Corporatism ie controlled capitalism.

If TLP dropped the Identitarianism they'd have swept the board a while ago but unfortunately there is still the  belief that masculinity is 'toxic' and whiteness is 'privileged'.

Some white men still vote for them.


And we still have self-declared Marxist MPs and an MP financed by CCCP.
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Bill Buxton
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« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2023, 01:05:44 PM »

Would the lefties define socialism. Given their definition, is there any country in the world that has adopted this system,and did it work?
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Rutters
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« Reply #16 on: February 19, 2023, 01:30:34 PM »

I'd also like to see someone clarify what demarcates their definitions of Socialism and Communism (apart from speeded of arrival at destination).

After all, Marxism makes Nazism (National SOCIALISM) look like a picnic in the park. Imagine a Tory MP openly stating he's a Nazi mick
https://videos.dailymail.co.uk/video/mol/2016/09/15/6136380872641826528/640x360_MP4_6136380872641826528.mp4
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Rutters
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« Reply #17 on: February 19, 2023, 01:31:34 PM »

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Black_Book_of_Communism
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myboro
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« Reply #18 on: February 20, 2023, 12:20:40 AM »

Would the lefties define socialism. Given their definition, is there any country in the world that has adopted this system,and did it work?
UK from end of Second World War to Thatcher is my idea of Socialism that works for the many.
Inequality in UK at highest since pre-WW2
Same example is USA from WWII to Reagan, have you been asleep to ask such a stupid question. Shame we sold everything we had to allow the rich to get richer and the poor to get poorer. Its OK though you bought a house and have a Pension so your all right jack  :nige:
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Henry Chinaski
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« Reply #19 on: February 20, 2023, 02:07:18 AM »

Would the lefties define socialism. Given their definition, is there any country in the world that has adopted this system,and did it work?

It's very simple. Most of our neighbours in North and Western Europe operate balanced economies. A capitalistic foundation but natural monopolies are state owned to stop massive exploitation

The Nordic Model of progressive social democracies is consistently scored highest for life satisfaction, with low levels of inequality being highly correlated with happiness

You can run countries as progressive SOCIAL DEMOCRACIES like our most successful neighbours and it massively reduces poverty and increases well-being of the population

Or you can copy America and go for extreme capitalism with everything privatised, making the rich richer and the poor poorer, as we are doing

Wanting to have a balanced economy, with social well-being a priority is not "hard left" it is the norm in sane countries.

Labour is not proposing pure socialism, it's social democracy with the right balance between private and public sector

Repeatedly voting for the maximum benefit of the super-wealthy and against the  interest of your own class,  children and grand-children is obviously a very stupid thing to do

souey
« Last Edit: February 20, 2023, 03:55:58 PM by Henry Chinaski » Logged

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myboro
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« Reply #20 on: February 20, 2023, 02:21:37 AM »

Would the lefties define socialism. Given their definition, is there any country in the world that has adopted this system,and did it work?

It's very simple. Most of our neighbours in North and Western Europe operate balanced economies. A capitalistic foundation but natural monopolies are state owned to stop massive exploitation

The Nordic Model of progressive social democracies is consistently scored highest for life satisfaction, with low levels of inequality being highly correlated with happiness

You can run countries as progressive SOCIAL DEMOCRACIES like our most successful neighbours and it massively reduces poverty and increases well-being of the population

Or you can copy America and go for extreme capitalism with everything privatised, making the rich richer and the poor poorer, as we are doing

Wanting to have a balanced economy, with social well-being a priority is not "hard left" it is the norm in sane countries. Unfortunately in England we have a poorly educated working class with over half mis-informed enough to constantly vote against their own interests

Labour is not proposing pure socialism, it's social democracy with the right balance between private and public sector

Repeatedly voting for the maximum benefit of the super-wealthy and against the  interest of your own class,  children and grand-children is obviously a very stupid thing to do, but a lot of poorly educated people do exactly that

souey

Well said but it will fall on 12 Deaf ears in this Forum  :nige:
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kippers
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« Reply #21 on: February 20, 2023, 09:13:51 AM »

Would the lefties define socialism. Given their definition, is there any country in the world that has adopted this system,and did it work?
UK from end of Second World War to Thatcher is my idea of Socialism that works for the many.
Inequality in UK at highest since pre-WW2
Same example is USA from WWII to Reagan, have you been asleep to ask such a stupid question. Shame we sold everything we had to allow the rich to get richer and the poor to get poorer. Its OK though you bought a house and have a Pension so your all right jack  :nige:

Ok. So the idea of 'inequality' is everyone being poor ?
Thats how I remember the sixties and seventies. Except for the elite of course.....meaning there has always been inequality.
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Rutters
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« Reply #22 on: February 20, 2023, 10:33:30 AM »

So glad we've all rejected what is currently called 'Socialism' in favour of a mixed economy but how do we cope with Labour MPs still calling themselves Marxist? Isn't that indicative of an underlying belief system? Isn't it extremism?

Whilst the Nordic Models seem attractive they do reveal a deep-seated resentment which manifests itself in high suicide rates. Also telling is the emergence of The Patriarchy Paradox which renders all that Identity Politics counter-productive for so long.

Talking about IDpols, do you think an average white bloke in Brambles Farm seriously thinks Lammy, Abbott or Phillips give a flying fig about him or his life?

Personally, I think the focus on 'Inequality' is misplaced. If those at the bottom have a good life then I'm not jealous of what those at the top are making. The gap is irrelevant.

What we can see on here again is Labour supporters treating the real working-class an ignorant, ill-educated fools who don't know what they're doing. They do...and that sort of pompous arrogance never wins votes.
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Henry Chinaski
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« Reply #23 on: February 20, 2023, 12:47:17 PM »

So glad we've all rejected what is currently called 'Socialism' in favour of a mixed economy but how do we cope with Labour MPs still calling themselves Marxist? Isn't that indicative of an underlying belief system? Isn't it extremism?

Whilst the Nordic Models seem attractive they do reveal a deep-seated resentment which manifests itself in high suicide rates. Also telling is the emergence of The Patriarchy Paradox which renders all that Identity Politics counter-productive for so long.

Talking about IDpols, do you think an average white bloke in Brambles Farm seriously thinks Lammy, Abbott or Phillips give a flying fig about him or his life?

Personally, I think the focus on 'Inequality' is misplaced. If those at the bottom have a good life then I'm not jealous of what those at the top are making. The gap is irrelevant.

What we can see on here again is Labour supporters treating the real working-class an ignorant, ill-educated fools who don't know what they're doing. They do...and that sort of pompous arrogance never wins votes.

I disagree. A working class person who thinks Boris Johnson or Sunak went into politics to help people like those in Brambles Farm is wholly ignorant of the reality

The Tories are the party of the establishment and inherited wealth and privilege. They have no solution to the cost of living crisis their policies and disastrous Brexit have delivered. So they copy the right in America by focusing on a fake "culture war" to distract...

Convince people there is a different crisis and only they have the answer. Currently the scapegoat is immigrants in small boats.  

The day after the 2019 election the BBC interviewed two unemployed blokes sharing a bedsit in Burnley. They blamed Jeremy Corbyn for their situation and actually believed Boris Johnson would help them



Pure ignorance of 9 years of Tory incompetence. They spoke like Labour had been in power and the Tories had just overturned them...
« Last Edit: February 20, 2023, 02:27:23 PM by Henry Chinaski » Logged

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Rutters
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« Reply #24 on: February 20, 2023, 05:02:32 PM »

I'd be willing to bet a Working Class bloke from Brambles Farm has more affinity with ex-miner Lee Anderson than Dianne Abbott or David Lammy. The ignorance is not theirs.

Politics hasn't been about wealth, establishment or privilege for a long time. It's about belonging and identity. The left created the Culture Wars via post-modernism and Critical Race/Gender Theories which prioritised victimhood because the current working class simply weren't revolutionary enough for them.

You can't now call them 'fake' just because most people have had enough of Radical Feminism, a Marxist BLM, Drag storytime and Transactivism.

The only connection is that the wealthy, middle-class. establishment are now more likely to be the leftist, woke, road-blocking, statue defacing, care4calais, anti-tory activists.

The problem is that if the WC saw a party offering a viable solution they wouldn't blame the people coming here from safe countries and taking spaces in doctors, dentists, schools, hotels without their families contributing for decades. What else would you expect?

The Tories have been a massive left down, as were Labour before them (and will be again). What comes next is the interesting part.

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Bob End and his Sexy Bitch
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« Reply #25 on: February 20, 2023, 05:59:18 PM »

That covered all the buttons, I feel
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Henry Chinaski
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« Reply #26 on: February 20, 2023, 06:11:07 PM »

I'd be willing to bet a Working Class bloke from Brambles Farm has more affinity with ex-miner Lee Anderson than Dianne Abbott or David Lammy. The ignorance is not theirs.

Politics hasn't been about wealth, establishment or privilege for a long time. It's about belonging and identity. The left created the Culture Wars via post-modernism and Critical Race/Gender Theories which prioritised victimhood because the current working class simply weren't revolutionary enough for them.

You can't now call them 'fake' just because most people have had enough of Radical Feminism, a Marxist BLM, Drag storytime and Transactivism.

The only connection is that the wealthy, middle-class. establishment are now more likely to be the leftist, woke, road-blocking, statue defacing, care4calais, anti-tory activists.

The problem is that if the WC saw a party offering a viable solution they wouldn't blame the people coming here from safe countries and taking spaces in doctors, dentists, schools, hotels without their families contributing for decades. What else would you expect?

The Tories have been a massive left down, as were Labour before them (and will be again). What comes next is the interesting part.

Some fair points, though 30p Lee is a genuine shyster currently grifting using his authentic WC background. Also linked to far right extremists as more than a few current Tory MP's are. UKIP/NF not-so-lite...

The immigration crisis is due to Brexit and the failure of the Tories to control our borders - they claimed we needed Brexit to do that. Almost as if letting the immigration system fall apart provides a convenient distraction.

People's innate mis-trust of outsiders/others is frequently used by politicians to appeal to primal fear, rage and hatred. A good way to fool people into voting against their own interests. Pure Orwellian "15 minutes of hate"

Obviously you are obsessed with Identity Politics which I never mentioned until now. You even said "Talking about IDpols..." when only you had brought that up.

I did go overboard on the "uneducated" aspect to get a reaction. The majority of WC people are not ignorant, but the minority who are seem to get all the air-time, e.g. Hartlepool By-election interviews with useful idiots, where non of the false beliefs are questioned by the BBC reporters

People need to wake up to the fact the Tory government is not running things in the interests of most of the people. They are following the policies of a number of right-wing think tanks with a pro-fossil fuel & Libertarian agenda. Most people do not understand that, IMHO


« Last Edit: February 20, 2023, 06:21:00 PM by Henry Chinaski » Logged

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Rutters
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« Reply #27 on: February 20, 2023, 10:49:53 PM »

I respect your right to call anyone a 'shyster' but unless you can substantiate it, it bears no gravitas. I'd like to know who these extremists are because I can think of nothing to the left of Marxism but I can think of lots to the right of border defenders.

The immigration crisis is due to lack of implementation of Brexit.

Innate mistrust of outsiders perfectly explains Labour supporter's fear, rage and hatred of Tories. It's why they 'other', de-humanise, abuse and demonise them rather than engage. It allows them to refuse to accept that some people feel voting for them is in their best interests.

ID politics is the current raison d'etre of Labour politics. It's why Khan is Mayor of London and Lammy MP of Tottenham. Saying someone is 'obsessed' should stay on the playground.

If it's not what you thought, you wouldn't have written it.

You're doing it again. Right wing think tanks are the same as left-wing think tanks. They similarly believe that they have the best solutions to the county's problems. Because of your demonisation of the 'other' you believe them to be self-serving and something we need to be 'woke' to.

They're actually not evil, they just have different options.
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Bill Buxton
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« Reply #28 on: February 20, 2023, 11:09:28 PM »

Wasn't it Lammy who said people who voted for Brexit were worse than Nazis. I thought Lefties were supposed to be kind caring people. It seems to me that they are consumed by bike and hatred.
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Rutters
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« Reply #29 on: February 20, 2023, 11:49:43 PM »

His race-baiting is negated by his comedic contributions

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55FW9hw2M-Q&ab_channel=VoiceOfReason
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Henry Chinaski
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« Reply #30 on: February 21, 2023, 12:43:54 AM »

If it's not what you thought, you wouldn't have written it.


Utter nonsense. I could write down 10 statements of imaginary opinion that I don't actually believe. Any number. You must be genuinely autistic if you think everything someone writes is a 100% reflection of their actual beliefs.

I believe Vote Leave ran a fair campaign, broke no electoral funding rules, and Cambridge Analytica had no involvement with them and broke no data protection laws.

See?

:nige:
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« Reply #31 on: February 21, 2023, 10:53:03 AM »

The solution would appear to be quite simple.

If you don't think the working-class are: 'very stupid', 'wholly ignorant', 'purely ignorant', 'false believers', 'easily distracted', 'primal', 'foolish', 'uneducated' or 'useful idiots' then don't write it because we will rightly think that that's what you truly believe.

It's symptomatic of a current metropolitan Labour Party sneering at the working-class which created it. Just look at Emily Thornberry... Red walls crumble.

btw  Vote Leave broke electoral laws. Even The Guardian admitted it so you're alone on that one.

See?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/17/vote-leave-broke-electoral-law-and-british-democracy-is-shaken
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kippers
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« Reply #32 on: February 21, 2023, 12:19:22 PM »

The man in the street or WC usually just crack on with life, otherwise politics can totally consume you, as it did with my father.
  Personally, I avoid news as much as possible as it is all generally bad news and something I dont need in my life.
  The sooner you understand that the vast majority of people dont want radical change, and currently the conservative party offers stability, regardless of other stuff going on.
 They are most likely coming to the end of that power and labour could be currently well positioned to take over, barring any self inflicted fuck ups. That was never possible with Corbyn at the helm, too far left.
  I feel Brexit would have happened under labour too if a vote was offered. It was people that voted, not Westminster.

  So its really a bit pointless arguing politics anywhere as a consensus can never be reached, especially online.
 
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« Reply #33 on: February 21, 2023, 04:08:37 PM »

Politics isn't about consensus. If it was there would be no Politics.

Politics is about competing ideas of governance. Collectivism v individualism.

I do agree with your point about most people being ambivalent about it...until it impacts them personally.
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Henry Chinaski
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« Reply #34 on: February 21, 2023, 11:44:32 PM »


btw  Vote Leave broke electoral laws. Even The Guardian admitted it so you're alone on that one.

See?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/17/vote-leave-broke-electoral-law-and-british-democracy-is-shaken

Jesus wept. If you didn't grasp I was deliberately stating an opinion in writing where I believe the opposite,  then I don't know how to break it to you...

souey

Politics, yeah we won't agree. But this Tory incarnation is not stable or economically competent. The VIP lane corruption is all about privileged people with no experience of the way the business world actually works funnelling money to their chums because they thought that was the "right" thing to do

Tory economic competence is a lie. Stability when half the cabinet were disaster capitalists betting against the UK economy while billions wiped off pension funds

Looks like the young are not so easily conned based on recent voting patterns.

« Last Edit: February 22, 2023, 07:03:10 AM by Henry Chinaski » Logged

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« Reply #35 on: February 22, 2023, 11:36:16 AM »

If you can't proficiently convey your meaning then that's not my concern.

I'm not a Tory but I do know that the young do tend to be left-leaning. I also know that the young have a tendency to get old and that voting patterns have a tendency to change.

...and young people tend not to vote.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2023, 01:42:02 PM by Rutters » Logged
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